Shop Mobile More Submit  Join Login
You Can't Even Argue This Point by SionnaDehr You Can't Even Argue This Point by SionnaDehr
I mean really, the phrase, "because God said so" makes more logical sense than "if animals can do itz totes fine!"
For the most part, people use this to try and say homosexuality is okay. I find that a problem. I find that a big problem. After all, I thought humans were supposed to be evolved beyond basic animalistic tendencies. Using this argument to try and prove what many view to be a lifestyle choice doesn't work very well.
May I draw you to this stamp [link] that explains the issue in better words than I ever could? Well, I just did so I will continue.
Animals do a lot of things that we find rather disgusting if a human does it. Like cannibalism for an example.
Links to Cannibalism:
[link](zoology) -for a general idea of it in the wild.
[link]
[link]
[link]
[link]

Let's see, what else is out there? Oh yes! Rape in animals!
[link]

Of course, when searching for this on the internet, I mostly find shit about human abuse to animals concerning this subject. I'm not going to dig through the internet to find this stuff.

Now, what else can I list? Oh, wait, killing!
[link]

If I had the mindset to think of the right keywords, I would probably have a better time finding what I'm looking for. As it is, I have a head cold, so my research skills are down. Anyway, the list could go on and I'm sure if I looked harder under all categorical abominations (or what are considered abominations in the human race). My point is that if people are going to try and prove something right, they might not want to use the animal kingdom as a reliable source. Yes, I'm especially talking to you evolutionists who loooove using this excuse. Find something else, please?

Actually, if there are any other arguments out there, please feel free to comment and tell me the other reasons. I'm not as interested in refuting them as I am interested in knowing what people are saying.

EDIT
[link] Adding this because it accurately illustrates the sheer stupidity of the "animals do it so its okay" argument.
Add a Comment:
 
:iconsierrafaith:
SierraFaith Featured By Owner Jul 15, 2015  Hobbyist Artist
Yes
Reply
:iconjosh-toons:
Josh-Toons Featured By Owner Jul 13, 2015  Hobbyist Filmographer
"Jimmy! Stop pooping on the lawn!"
"But mom, wolves do it!"
Reply
:iconisapphirus:
iSapphirus Featured By Owner Jul 7, 2015  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Thanks for making this stamp. Ppl always use aimals as excuses in general for things.
Reply
:iconstella-miner:
Stella-Miner Featured By Owner Edited Jul 10, 2015
your profile pic... I love it
Reply
:iconisapphirus:
iSapphirus Featured By Owner Jul 10, 2015  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Thanks a lot. ^^
Reply
:icontheicarlyangel:
TheiCarlyAngel Featured By Owner Edited Jun 11, 2015  Student Artist
Gothic-Bunny-13 :
Jak Rolls Eyes Thanks Bunny for yet another one of your disgusting lies. I can support and not support whatever I want. Get over it already. Rainbow Dash (facepalm) #2 plz 

fidofia:
 I've also been bullied and hurt as Hell too, both physically and emotionally. How the heck am I hateful for not supporting something that I find uncomfortable, unnatural, and wrong? It's not my fault your emotional disorder gets in the way of who you are. I won't feel bad for people who don't at least try to be okay and be happy. If they seek for help, guidance, acceptance, and love, then everything will be fine. I guarantee you 100%. And don't say 'You're the reason why they can't!' Terrible excuse. I am not stopping them for not seeking for help in real life or online for that matter. You also make the LGBT being bullied look like a complete joke when you call me hateful when I haven't even met them in real life, nor was I a part of their past nor present. I stated an opinion of what I think, nothing more.

Also so you're saying you think heterosexuality is unnatural, wrong, and not a good thing? In which I have no problem with, but it sounds like what you're implying. :P Also yeah, I do refuse to what gay programs. I already do that. I'm just saying that I am disappointed that they would do that. I never said gays wasn't for television. That's why I rarely watch anime since you have that.

I can help make them feel okay and welcomed and help let them know I won't judge them like a book from it's cover, but I refuse to support homosexuality and that is something they're going to have to emotionally control. It's not my fault they didn't seek for a loved one's help to help make them feel stronger.
Reply
:iconnightengale1028:
nightengale1028 Featured By Owner Jun 4, 2015
....you do under stand that humans are animals and biodiversity is a good thing right? The only difference is that were senescent and even then thats not a big difference  just please for the love of god get off your high horse.
Reply
:iconthetruemadhatter:
TheTrueMadHatter Featured By Owner Jun 3, 2015  Student General Artist
 //Well we are animals.
Reply
:iconjustsomestranger:
JustSomeStranger Featured By Owner Edited May 19, 2015  Hobbyist General Artist
"I thought humans were supposed to be evolved beyond basic animalistic tendencies"

That's not what evolution is about AT ALL. The basic concept of evolution is about a species changing to adapt to a specific or to multiple environments so they can survive & reproduce.

Also, views on cannibalism range from culture to culture. Most cultures (including western culture) view it as immoral. There are however, many cultures that don't, and practice it whenever a member of their community has died as a way to honour them.

The point of the argument that "animals do it too" is to show you that humans really aren't much different to animals. Which we're not. We're not the only species to use tools, practice farming, keep pets, or in this case, partake in gay sex.

Humans will always have instincts considered to be "animalistic" (I.e. sexuality, aggression, etc) because humans ARE animals. The fact that most of us live in houses hasn't changed that.

EDIT: Also, I would just like to point out. While the post you linked is right in some parts, never the less has a very poor understanding of animal phycology & behavior.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Etholo…

I would point out why this is, except the topic of animal behaviour is so vast & complicated & even I only have a very basic understanding of it.
Reply
:iconnightengale1028:
nightengale1028 Featured By Owner Jun 4, 2015
actually there are some chimps and primates that use sticks to get honey out of be hives or trees. 
Reply
:iconjustsomestranger:
JustSomeStranger Featured By Owner Jun 5, 2015  Hobbyist General Artist
I know. I think you may have misread the sentence.

I'd said "We're NOT the only species to use tools, practice farming, keep pets, or in this case, partake in gay sex."
Reply
:iconnightengale1028:
nightengale1028 Featured By Owner Jun 5, 2015
oh im sorry. I call my bad. but your right. I agree
Reply
:iconkenikogen:
KenikoGen Featured By Owner May 19, 2015  Student General Artist
I just love the appeal to nature fallacy.
Reply
:icondolcinea:
Dolcinea Featured By Owner Apr 27, 2015  Professional Interface Designer
Oh sh*t, the irony in this stamp and argument is just too real!

Oh god, I am laughing so f*cking hard...
Reply
:iconmclandis:
Mclandis Featured By Owner Apr 18, 2015  Hobbyist Photographer
For the most part, people use this to try and say homosexuality is okay. I find that a problem. I find that a big problem. After all, I thought humans were supposed to be evolved beyond basic animalistic tendencies.

Umm...no. Humans have evolved a certain way, but we are still animals and behave as such.

People only use this defense in response to the hilariously wrong claim that "all homo sex is unnatural." Clearly, if other animals are doing it, it's not unnatural.

Using this argument to try and prove what many view to be a lifestyle choice doesn't work very well.

Except being gay is not something someone "chooses" to do any more than you can choose your height.

Animals do a lot of things that we find rather disgusting if a human does it.

And notice how all of those somehow require harming other individuals (cannibalism being the exception). A consensual homosexual relationship between two adults, on the other hand, is not harmful.
Reply
:iconcrazyaniknowit:
Crazyaniknowit Featured By Owner Apr 13, 2015  Hobbyist General Artist
Omg this is soo true! I use this in every argument about such stupid things! "Well animals are homo's sometimes so we can do it too!" So animals eat their young...are we supposed to start eating babies? lol
Reply
:iconilovewheatley:
ilovewheatley Featured By Owner Apr 2, 2015  Hobbyist General Artist
The idea of this argument was to prove mostly to Christians it wasn't a purely 'man-made' thing, I think. Honestly I'm more for the pre-natal theory, or my personal Buddhist theory, but that cannot be proven.
But I see what they're trying to say. Being gay is set apart from those other things e.g murder, rape ext because it doesn't involve the pain of another human being. Those things cause pain to others, which is considered immoral, but being attracted to the same sex as you doesn't hurt anybody. Its a weak argument, but it has its footing. 
Reply
:iconrat--shackles:
rat--shackles Featured By Owner Mar 21, 2015  Student General Artist
[[ "animals eat food off the ground, but when i do it, why do i feel weird after?" ]]
Reply
:iconmoo-sho:
Moo-Sho Featured By Owner Mar 15, 2015
"Animals do it!" Is indeed not a good argument to prove homosexuality is okay because it's not an argument for that at all...

It's a rebuttal to people who say homosexuality is unnatural so it's not okay. It leaves people only to rely on the scriptures as "proof" against homosexuality or "it's icky so I think it's wrong!" which is an even poorer argument.

If you don't like homosexuality for your own reasons that's fine, but if you support legislation banning same-sex marriage or discrimination against the gay community that's when it crosses line for me.

Either way, I wish you the best. I try not to be too aggressive if it can be helped. :)
Reply
:icontheodorvahlen:
TheodorVahlen Featured By Owner Jun 3, 2015
And the same could just as easily be said for people who wish to marry dogs, children, or even trees. I mean love is obviously blind, right? Who's to judge anyway? Equality is grand. Why limit it to just straights and gays? Why, that's bigoted!
Reply
:iconmoo-sho:
Moo-Sho Featured By Owner Jun 5, 2015
Dogs and trees cannot consent at all and children under 18 cannot consent in the eyes of the law (in the USA) to keep them safer from predators.

(Though if someone wants a ceremonial, non-legal marriage with a tree I personally don't care, lol.)
Reply
:icontheodorvahlen:
TheodorVahlen Featured By Owner Jun 5, 2015
So if consent weren't an issue you would be fine with these things?
Reply
:iconmoo-sho:
Moo-Sho Featured By Owner Jun 5, 2015
If everyone & everything in question was sentient and as mentally developed as the average adult then I guess so. I might still find some things weird or creepy, but so is an 18 year old marrying a senior citizen. Doesn't mean we can make it illegal.

Look, I can see you have values you strongly believe in and want to defend and I can understand that. I hope I'm not coming off as too snarky.
Reply
:iconfidofia:
fidofia Featured By Owner Mar 9, 2015  Hobbyist Writer
TheiCarlyAngel 

???? how was I supposed to know your tragic backstory before commenting? I'm only commenting on what I already know about you, which is that you are very hateful. Look, I am really sorry about the fact you've been sexually abused. That's horrible and no child should ever have to go through that. But that's about where the sympathy ends. You think I haven't been bullied like absolute fuck? You think gay people haven't been bullied by insensitive jerks. Now, I don't know what "LGBTs" have done to you but homosexuality is not a religion, and I don't know why you're so against all types of love love. 

"Also unlike homosexuality, in which is wrong, heterosexuality is okay and it is not wrong in any shape nor form. That's something everyone can agree on without throwing a meltdown."

Um. No. No, actually I don't think homosexuality is wrong, thanks. I think it is love and love is perfectly natural. If anything I don't know why you are shoving your beliefs down our throats and into our television. Television isn't just for straight people you know. If you, a straight person, don't want to see gays in a TV program, flick to any other channel ever. I guarantee you will fine more straight white heteros any where you look. 

Also if you have so much empathy to people being bullied. Why not start by not making people feel uncomfortable in their own identity. If you can't see that you're part of the problem then you're blind to yourself. Please, I'm begging you just don't spread hate. Yes, that comment about the things you like was immature. I apologise. I'm just so sick of this happening every time I log onto deviantart. Can you please just take down your offensive stamps and try to understand where I'm coming from? We've both been bullied for liking what we like, maybe we can both try and be a little more accepting?
Reply
:icongothic-bunny-13:
Gothic-Bunny-13 Featured By Owner Mar 17, 2015  Hobbyist General Artist
She is hateful as fuck...
Reply
:icontheicarlyangel:
TheiCarlyAngel Featured By Owner Mar 7, 2015  Student Artist
I agree. Thumbs Up THUMBS UP! :D
Reply
:iconashlynart-100:
AshlynArt-100 Featured By Owner Feb 24, 2015  Hobbyist Artist
Someone gave me this reason. -.-
Reply
:iconfidofia:
fidofia Featured By Owner Feb 20, 2015  Hobbyist Writer
If you're not gay how the fuck does homosexuality concern you? Does it hurt you? Does it affect your standard of living?
Reply
:iconmoo-sho:
Moo-Sho Featured By Owner Mar 15, 2015
Best not to come on too strong in these type of topics. I understand your passion but I try a calmer, logic-based way of debating.

At least in the states discrimination is being more discouraged and many more states have same-sex marriage than even 5 years ago! I think more people are realizing loved ones and friends who have come out are still the same great people that they were before coming out.
Reply
:icontheicarlyangel:
TheiCarlyAngel Featured By Owner Mar 7, 2015  Student Artist
Because people shove their beliefs in other's faces when they don't choose to follow their ways. Plus it's now going into kids cartoons.
Reply
:iconfidofia:
fidofia Featured By Owner Mar 8, 2015  Hobbyist Writer
Gay people don't want you to "follow their ways", they just want a little respect and acceptance. Oh, because childrens' cartoons have always been so lacking in romance. I've seen countless heterosexual relationships in children's TV. So much it's excessive. Now tell me why that is so different to a hetero relationship in a cartoon.

Also, just saying you're name is "TheiCarlyAngel" and you're not even in high school yet. Maybe you should wait until you have a better understanding of basic human empathy like every other normal human being
Reply
:icontheicarlyangel:
TheiCarlyAngel Featured By Owner Mar 9, 2015  Student Artist
Then you'll get your respect and acceptance, but it's not the same thing as shoving down your beliefs in other's faces 24/7. Okay? Okay. Also unlike homosexuality, in which is wrong, heterosexuality is okay and it is not wrong in any shape nor form. That's something everyone can agree on without throwing a meltdown.

Also are you kidding...? You're... wow... I cannot even respond to that... age and what grade you are in has nothing to do with maturity and empathy. Just LOOK at your own post.

Hey, look. I've been bullied too, okay? I been through fudging Hell and back and I am trying to save my own butt on staying strong and being kind and respectful to others. I've been sexually abused ever since I was a little girl and was FORCED to watch porn and become this 'little good cum girl' and stare at photos of naked woman and men and even girl and girl and men and men jacking it off with one another. I've also been bullied since the 3rd grade and I know exactly the guy who started it. I was never EVER accepted by anyone in my school because of what I liked and was made fun of my happiness and kindness and they made me cry everyday in class. Also guess what you special little snowflake, I've also gotten my heart BROKEN by a guy who abandoned me and left me to worry and he simply didn't care for me at all. Seriously, sometimes at nights or even at days I cry because my heart is hurt. I really am hurt and confused (but not that confused where I have to follow your homosexual religion, NO THANKS) on what to do with myself right now. There are days I wished I was in Heaven right than Earth. Days I wished I didn't exist or have amnesia where I can feel happiness JUST like I did when I was a little girl (before becoming introduced by sex) and I was Easter-egg hunting and spinning in circles happily. I much rather feel innocence than feeling like no one is here for you. In real life, I have no one to hold onto nor I can rely on. I am thankful for my online friends because they understand my hurt and everything about me. Sometimes I wonder, "How come making friends online is easier than in real life?" So what exactly do you mean by not feeling ANY empathy, again? -_- In fact, It's hard for me to feel sorry for any of the LGBTs when they have treated me disrespectful when I have done nothing wrong AND are forcing their beliefs on me. Look, do whatever makes you happy. I'm blocking you because this whole conversation is now reaching to a negative level. You obviously won't understand, so I don't get WHY I even bothered. You don't know me in real life to even make that statement a fact. So before you accuse me, do your research.
Reply
:iconmclandis:
Mclandis Featured By Owner Apr 18, 2015  Hobbyist Photographer
Then you'll get your respect and acceptance, but it's not the same thing as shoving down your beliefs in other's faces 24/7.

Ironically, I get more Christians doing that to me than gay people.

Also unlike homosexuality, in which is wrong, heterosexuality is okay and it is not wrong in any shape nor form. That's something everyone can agree on without throwing a meltdown

Actually, there is nothing objectively wrong with being gay.

In fact, It's hard for me to feel sorry for any of the LGBTs when they have treated me disrespectful when I have done nothing wrong AND are forcing their beliefs on me.

Having a problem with LGBTQ individuals who are assholes is one thing. Hating on them all because you met some bad ones, on the other hand, is silly at best.

Keep in mind that Christians, for many years, outright murdered gay people, and when they couldn't do that, they inflicted other indignities on them (just read about what happened to Alan Turing if you want a historical example).
Reply
:icontheicarlyangel:
TheiCarlyAngel Featured By Owner Apr 18, 2015  Student Artist
Being gay is wrong, but feel free to believe and follow whatever you want. :)
I respect your opinion. ^^;

I've met some good ones, but me feeling sorry for every last one of them is just hard to do.

If any Christian does that, than they are not Christians and that sounds more like the SJW than Christians/Catholics.
The bible teaches love and not hate,
Reply
:iconmclandis:
Mclandis Featured By Owner Apr 18, 2015  Hobbyist Photographer
Being gay is wrong

No it isn't. There is nothing to suggest this.

If any Christian does that, than they are not Christians and that sounds more like the SJW than Christians/Catholics.

No True Scotsman fallacy. Those people are Christians as much as anyone else.

The bible teaches love and not hate,

:lol:

We must be reading very different Bibles, then. Love is the last thing I'd describe as coming from a book that condones slavery and genocide and promises an eternal, fiery punishment for those who don't believe.
Reply
:icontheodorvahlen:
TheodorVahlen Featured By Owner Jun 3, 2015
Being a pedophile or zoophile is not wrong then. Don't like it? Don't do it.

The same argument could just as easily be held in spite of your ignorance. It's funny. But moreso sad that so many have the sheep-like mentality, doing anything they can just to fit in.

It's also funny you ended that comment in a strawman yourself, talk about fallacies.
Reply
(1 Reply)
:icontheicarlyangel:
TheiCarlyAngel Featured By Owner Apr 18, 2015  Student Artist
Yes, because they are the same gender and it is revolting and unnatural. I believe a man and a woman were created for a reason.
You're welcome.

Christians do not bash at people. They are not worthy nor holy to be a Christian.

We must and you must be reading a very inaccurate bible written by an idiot.
Reply
(1 Reply)
:iconfidofia:
fidofia Featured By Owner Mar 8, 2015  Hobbyist Writer
also lmao your stamps. You're literally 12 aren't you.
Reply
:iconballisticpacifist:
BallisticPacifist Featured By Owner Feb 14, 2015
How does homosexuality hurt people like rape or killing?
Reply
:iconbbchild:
BBChild Featured By Owner Feb 17, 2015   Traditional Artist
The point is not whether or not homosexuality harms individuals (which it arguably does).

The point is that this particular argument - "It is natural among animals, therefore it should be acceptable among people" - is extremely flawed and "moronic" since animals do many things that are unacceptable in human society.

Natural =/= good.  That is what this stamp is about.
Reply
:iconvikingponeswordsgirl:
VikingPoneSwordsgirl Featured By Owner Feb 9, 2015  Hobbyist Writer
The point isn't that homosexuality is ok isn't usually backed up with the animals argument, the "animals do it" argument is used to prove homosexuality is natural since humans are part of the animal kingdom; we're primates.

Also how the heck are rape and homosexuality the same? No one wants to accept rape, there's a whole movement dedicated to gay rights. Homosexual relationships are usually consensual, and rape isn't there is a difference :| arguing rape and relationships are the same is stupid.
Reply
:iconbbchild:
BBChild Featured By Owner Feb 12, 2015   Traditional Artist
"Natural" does not equate to "good" or "acceptable."

Animals rape each other.
Animals commit acts of incest all the time.
Animals murder each other - male, female, young, or old.
Animals shun each other just because of their size or smell.
Animals will kill children of other animals in order to have sex with the female/mother.
Animals are cannibals.

All of those things are "natural" and "normal" in nature.  That does not mean they should be normal in our human society.

"Also how the heck are rape and homosexuality the same?"
^ Well, animals rape each other… It's all natural and normal for animals, why can't people do the same?
Reply
:iconvikingponeswordsgirl:
VikingPoneSwordsgirl Featured By Owner Edited Feb 12, 2015  Hobbyist Writer
I know natural doesn't equal to good or acceptable the point I'm trying to make is that this arguement is used not for proving that it's acceptable but just that it's natural seeming as many religions and cultures deem homosexuality as biologically unnatural. The author of the stamp seems to be confusing these two.

I can see the silliness in trying to compare humans and animals completely but that's not what people are doing with that arguement, they're just proving it's not unnatural. Animals are halfway to being humans because humans have a lot of urges which echo theirs except we are more evolved and intelligent because we picked a good path of evolution.

You didn't read my first comment correctly. I explained why they're different so either you're being purposesfully condescending or just simply didn't understand.

Rape= non consensual sex, a physical and psychological attack on a person which is immoral because it can cause great trauma (PTSD, suicidal tendencies etc) to the victim and make them almost unable to function because they can't trust other people and take great pains to get back into society after their attack as a result.

Homosexuality= netrual. I only say neutral because homosexuality is just at it's heart attraction to the same sex. Some use it for bad, but that's like all sexualities and no one wishes to legislate or ban straight people. Some are just normal people who wish to have a relationship just like anyone.

The majority of homosexual sex is consensual and is not rape every single time, it's not a trauma it's something shared between two people.

Heterosexuality is natural, why can't people rape like animals because hets have sex?
(I don't actually believe that it I just wanted to you to know how that sentence looks)
Reply
:iconbbchild:
BBChild Featured By Owner Feb 12, 2015   Traditional Artist
Ah okay.  Maybe I did misunderstand you then.

What I am getting at is... even if homosexuality is natural - so what?  Rape is also natural.  Murder is also natural.  Ect.

Whether or not homosexual behaviour is natural has nothing to do with whether or not it should be acceptable.  But I'm fairly certain you also understand that.  ^^
Reply
:iconvikingponeswordsgirl:
VikingPoneSwordsgirl Featured By Owner Feb 12, 2015  Hobbyist Writer
Why isn't it acceptable? Just because of this argument?

Human heterosexuality could be seen as dangerous too given that a woman can tear her um...birth canal, her organs shift around during pregnant and women are a little more likely to die when they are pregnant. Not to mention all the diseases you're susceptible to when pregnant. Is pregnancy safe because it's "natural"? Because that's what hetero sex is supposed to lead to without protection..

If you don't like homosexuality that's fine but it's not fair to say it's an unacceptable standard for everyone. Was interracial separation fair for everyone? After all both of those situations ie the acceptance of it is morally neutral...not really right or wrong but can cause more harm to the human race if it's limited excessively.
Reply
:iconbbchild:
BBChild Featured By Owner Feb 13, 2015   Traditional Artist
Err, where did I say that homosexuality was an "unacceptable standard for everyone?"

I will quote myself: "Whether or not homosexual behaviour is natural has nothing to do with whether or not it should be acceptable."
I'm pointing out that just because something is natural, does not mean that it should thus be considered acceptable.  I'm specifically referring to people who say, "If it happens in nature, it's therefore okay for it to happen in our society."  (i.e., "homosexuality is natural in animals, therefore it is acceptable in human societies")

I'm not arguing whether or not homosexuality itself is acceptable.  I'm just pointing out that:

Natural =/= good
And:
Natural =/= acceptable

Does that make sense?  It seems quite a few people have misunderstood my purpose here.
What I would REALLY like to know is how so many people started replying at once to me!  I always thought I was the only one who used the related tab to find argumentative stamps I like and then read the comments below them.  But apparently more people do that than I thought!  XD  (Or maybe more people just stalk each other's "Recent Activity" feeds more than I thought)
Reply
:iconbcollins39302:
bcollins39302 Featured By Owner Feb 12, 2015  Student Digital Artist
Rape and murder are not consensual...
Reply
:iconbbchild:
BBChild Featured By Owner Feb 12, 2015   Traditional Artist
Nope, but they are natural.  ^^
Reply
Add a Comment:
 
×




Details

Submitted on
October 30, 2012
Image Size
13.4 KB
Resolution
99×56
Link
Thumb
Embed

Stats

Views
3,886
Favourites
142 (who?)
Comments
449
Downloads
11
×